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Momtalk Maryland
The Dance of Connection: Breaking Destructive Patterns in Relationships
Ever wondered why relationship patterns seem to repeat themselves, generation after generation? Couples therapist Risa Ganel reveals the powerful truth behind this cycle and offers hope for breaking it during her illuminating conversation with Claire Duarte on MomTalk Maryland.
With nearly three decades of experience and specialized training in Relational Life Therapy (RLT), Risa shares how her journey began at age 12 when she discovered she was the only child at summer camp whose parents weren't divorced. This early awareness sparked a lifelong dedication to understanding and healing relationships, eventually leading her to study under relationship experts like Esther Perel and Terry Real.
What makes RLT revolutionary is its willingness to lovingly confront harmful behaviors rather than maintaining therapist neutrality. "If you speak harshly to your partner, you're not going to get a more warm and loving partner," Risa explains. This approach addresses both shame and its counterpart—grandiosity—creating space for genuine transformation.
The conversation explores Risa's upcoming Relationship Skills Boot Camp in Annapolis (September 20-21), a two-day workshop teaching essential skills for self-regulation and relationship repair. The workshop creates what Risa calls a "brave space" where participants can learn without pressure to share personal details. Day one focuses on relationship with self, while day two addresses connections with others.
Perhaps most compelling is Risa's insight on breaking intergenerational patterns: "Family dysfunction rolls downhill like a fire in the woods until one person has the courage to stand and face the flames." By healing our relationship wounds, we not only improve our current connections but create a healthier legacy for our children and future generations.
Ready to transform your relationships and become that courageous flame-facer? Visit togethercouplescounseling.com to register for the Relationship Skills Boot Camp. Early bird pricing ends August 31st!
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Hey friends and welcome to MomTalk, maryland. I'm your host, claire Duarte, founder of the Columbia Mom, and this is your spot for real conversations, local love and a whole lot of community. Whether you're folding laundry, running errands or hiding in your car for some peace and quiet, let's dive in and we are live. Well, I am so excited because today I have someone here with me. That is really special. I've actually known about Risa for several years.
Speaker 1:Before I knew about her, before she knew that, I knew about her, which is even better. That kind of speaks to just your presence and the work that you do, and when I finally got to meet you, you were probably just everything that I am, more than I imagined, and I've gotten to hear you speak at some networking events and the connections that we've made. But today I have with us Risa Ganel and we're here to talk about not only the work that she does but an upcoming workshop that she has in September that I am thrilled that I got to go to for the first time ever. So today I want to share with you about her, her background in her work, her philosophy, and also share with you guys all about the nuggets about this workshop, because this is something you definitely want to get excited about, and so take it away, risa. Tell us a little bit about you. Thanks, claire. So take it away, risa. Tell us a little bit about you, thanks.
Speaker 2:Claire. So I am a couples therapist and I have been practicing Well, my, my business has been in Howard County forever. I think I opened my doors in Howard County in 2005 out on my own, but I've been in practice since 1994. So I've been doing this a long time and that's you know a little bit about me. I work with couples and individuals and focus on relationship issues, and I don't know. Do you want me to tell a little bit about my background?
Speaker 1:I love an origin story, so I love.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you got it. So I I consider myself having started as a therapist when I was about 12, I think Right, maybe a little bit before that. You know, I was the one in my family, I'm the youngest of three and I was the one who would step in when my brother and sister were arguing and say cut it out and try and get them to stop. But even beyond that, this is really where the origin started. I went to sleepaway summer camp as a 12-year-old and this was in upstate New York back in the 80s, and in the bunk of 12 girls, my parents were the only parents who were still married and that was thoroughly shocking to the 12 year old me that that is a.
Speaker 1:If you do the numbers game, yeah, that's a lot. That's very striking.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I wrote an impassioned letter home to my parents about this and my mother kept. Well, she kept all my letters for many, many decades. But that's really where it all started for me, just sort of knowing that I wanted to study psychology. I was the one who was helping my friends. They'd come to me for advice. I had a dear, dear friend who in high school her father passed away suddenly and unexpectedly, and you know I I was good at writing letters. I wrote a letter to her as well and let me tell you, all these years later, with Facebook we reconnected and she still has the letter. So, oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:Wow, that is, that's powerful. I mean you even saying that I was like I don't know that there's been a point.
Speaker 1:I mean, obviously I've had friends and grown up and seen, um, you know, heard about, uh, friends that had divorced parents, but yeah, that's a pretty striking number and I feel like that's. I mean, it's questionable for anybody, but yeah, no doubt, and that obviously leads into the work that you've done, and I mean obviously being a couples therapist what? Why you were referred to me in the first place was also because of your training, and I want you to kind of share with us a little bit more about that as well.
Speaker 2:Sure so. I you know, when I went to college, I started studying psychology and the whole time I was there I was like darn it, you know, something's missing, like I don't. We're studying about abnormal psychology and diagnoses and all these. It was all focused on problems.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I just thought to myself there's something really missing here. It was really individually focused. And then I was introduced, just by chance, to a friend that I met who was studying marriage and family therapy. And again, this was the mid eighties, um mid to late eighties, and I had never heard of marriage and family therapy programs before and I knew I knew the second. I heard it. This is it because we do not live alone. We live in families.
Speaker 2:We live in systems, family systems, and so I went on to study marriage and family therapy here at the University of Maryland, college Park, and you know it's a really small program. They only admitted they still only admit 10 to 12 students a year. Yeah, cohort, and that was the jumping off point for me. So when I say I'm systemically trained, what I mean by that is I look at all problems, whether it's depression, anxiety, any mental health disorder or any issue in a family, as something that is a part of a system and it's happening for a reason that has to do with relationships and connection or disconnection.
Speaker 1:That's the, you know the simplest way I can state yeah, Well, and again, I'm obviously oriented this way which you know, and some of you might know my background, but just to kind of share that is, I also am a Terp. I studied psychology at Maryland in the early 2000s. I don't think the program well, I mean obviously in numbers, sure grown to some degree. But I remember also kind of feeling. I mean I went into college very impassioned, very excited kind of thing too, and I remember kind of, you know, I mean I actually did love my abnormal psych class. I thought it was very interesting is that I didn't think that's what I wanted to do, but I did really enjoy that class. I also really enjoyed the class that was on it's not called this, but it was essentially on brain development. I'm forgetting what it was, but and then which?
Speaker 1:Later on I got my, I have my master's in counseling psychology and as you know, I did become a therapist. But that is my roots, my history. So when you're talking about the systemic fit, I certainly, I certainly know where that comes from, because I remember learning about all the different types of therapy. And there's not just the types of therapy. Then there's the theories and the kind of orientations which us in this world. We kind kind of know and we nerd out a little bit. But it's important because, um, you know, you're taking a probably like a holistic sort of approach when you're looking at, uh, an individual or an individual within a family, an individual within a relationship, and I think that's important to have that lens yeah, um know, a lot of people know the saying or sort of the way of looking at things as, oh, I have to figure out myself before I can connect with somebody else, that kind of notion.
Speaker 2:I don't view things that way. I think we learn about who we are through our relationships. We learn about who we are through our connections and we do that from birth and so in my training. So I started at College Park but you know, I went on from there to work in all different types of settings in Baltimore, baltimore City, in group homes, in outpatient clinics, foster care, kids and so on, and Jewish family services. And I actually at one point many of your listeners may know the podcaster and well-known therapist, esther Perel, and she was my supervisor. I spent a year traveling to her office in Manhattan discussing cases. So some of my training certainly comes from work that I did with her. But more importantly and to this day, there have become fields or types of couples counseling right.
Speaker 2:Some of your listeners probably heard of Gottman, they've heard of emotionally focused therapy, eft, and the form of or the modality of, couples therapy that I do is what is called relational life therapy Relational Life Therapy created by Terry Real. I am trained, twice certified in his modality, and I teach for his institute. I teach other therapists how to do this, and Relational Life Therapy is a bit different than traditional couples therapy. One of the ways it's different is we sort of threw out the rule book when it comes to the sort of known standard of not taking sides, being neutral, that therapists should be neutral in the room. We don't do that in relational life therapy.
Speaker 2:There are times when it is appropriate to warmly and lovingly call into the attention of one person hey, this behavior that you're doing is getting in your way. It's getting in the way of what you want, which is more connection, more intimacy, a warmer, loving partner. But when you do this there's a cost to it. If you speak harshly to your partner, you're not going to get a more warm and loving partner Right, and so it's a little bit different in many ways. Relational life therapy that's just one example. You know we talk a lot about shame in psychotherapy or in therapy.
Speaker 2:but what is often left out of the discussion is the opposite of shame, which is grandiosity In relational life therapy. We're not afraid to take on grandiosity and work with it and name it in the room. Yeah and so yeah.
Speaker 1:I love that and I mean I think I'm so glad that you mentioned the Terry real part, because when I've been working with my own therapist for going on four and a half years now, any other type of couples therapist or family therapist or anything like that that you know, the reality is, when I was telling her, well, why do I need this type of? You know, if we were to ever see couples, why do I need this type of therapist, this relational therapist, someone that's you know, terry Real Certified, because she kept persuading me not to just like look in the phone book and pull up anyone because she was like that's, and you know she's like that's great and that's fine, but she was like they're not going to be able to support you in this kind of way and she kept finding these examples and I literally told her it was like it was absolutely annoying because, like you know, you know we're trying to, uh, I was like I'm trying to just get somebody that works with this blah blah blah.
Speaker 1:But she was like you need to find someone that is terry real certified, and like I and what's interesting, again, that's not something. Uh, you know, and I don't know exactly what time Terry real came on its name it certainly wasn't talked about when I was in grad school, um, so I wasn't familiar with that um or his work, um, until more recently, um, but now that I've gotten, now that I've read um, like one or one and two of his books, um, I have not yet taken any workshops of his um, uh, but now I'm excited to go, in September Exactly. So that's what, okay, and that's the other reason why we have Risa here today, because she has been doing these workshops, um and um.
Speaker 1:Again, as a mom, as a younger mom, and speaking to lots of other moms and women, obviously I'm very passionate about this because my background is in psychology and mental health and obviously, while I don't practice a lot of mental health directly in my work nowadays, it's just something that obviously, well, I do practice it. It I I, you know, still see my therapist regularly and I'm an advocate for mental health, right, um. But again, speaking as, uh, you know a mom and to so many other moms and women, I do feel like things like relationals within um, your family, marriage is often fresh and it's really hard and really challenging, and you know, my goal is to help bring some of that to light and to know and for others to know that, hey, you have resources, you have options and you have skills out there that you didn't even know that you needed. That can really help benefit you, and that's why we want to talk about that today.
Speaker 2:We want to talk about that today. Yeah, so I love that you say that, claire, because really the foundation of RLT relational life therapy is the notion that we are born to be in relationships. It's good for our health. We live longer lives when our relationships are strong and healthy, and that doesn't mean there's no conflict, right Doesn't mean there's just. Oh, let's pretend like everything is good when it's not. I call that dishonest harmony. We don't want that. But our relationships are what matter most and we're not taught how to navigate them in healthy, effective ways. Our culture supports rugged individualism and in RLT we aim to shift that.
Speaker 2:We operate from a different paradigm, a different way of thinking about things. That it's not about just me, what I need, what my attachment style is or what my love language is, if you use that as something you've identified for yourself but it's about us. We live in a biosphere. Just like if we pollute the Chesapeake Bay, it's going to affect Aruba, one of my favorite places to go, perfect example. Our relationships are a biosphere as well, and when you do something, when you behave in certain repetitive ways that are damaging to the relationship, it damages the entire biosphere. And so in the workshop that I do. We equip you to think about relationships in this different way.
Speaker 2:Think about not just your relationship to others, but your relationship to yourself, first and foremost, and identify the ways that you may be I'll say, shooting yourself in the foot from getting what you want. You want loving connection, but we often do. There's something we call the five losing strategies in relational life therapy, and they're the five main things that we tend to go to or do when we feel triggered or what we call that whoosh. That sort of comes over you when you feel like, oh my gosh, I can't believe they just said that or did this. And that automatic response we all have that built in Automatic response to things Like trigger. People refer to it as being triggered, we refer to it as being in a reactive mind, or your adaptive child state. Do you want me to say a little bit?
Speaker 1:about that I know. Well, I was going to say, before we jump into some of those terminology, let's tell us about the actual details. Day and time of the workshop. What people? What can people expect what? Who is this for what? What do people get out of it? You know, I think that's what would be most intriguing.
Speaker 2:Sure, All right. So the details September 20th and 21st in Annapolis at the Graduate Hotel. First in Annapolis at the Graduate Hotel. So it's a beautiful downtown Annapolis location, a great way and place to have a little getaway, whether you come as an individual or as a couple.
Speaker 1:Yes, and that was something I wanted you to make that you'd, I'm sure you probably encouraged couples, but you could still come as an individual. I think that's the message and still get a lot out of this that you can still bring home.
Speaker 2:To any relationship, not just romantic relationships. Exactly, this is about living a relational life, and so that could be with your best friend, it could be with your mother-in-law, you know. It's about relationships in general and and yes, couples, but individuals as well. Um, so, september 20th and 21st, we start at 9 30, we go till 5 30, we take a lunch break in the middle of the day and we have snacks for you, uh, at other break times during the day as well. It's a combination of presentation and group discussion and some breakout discussion with just you and whoever you're either there with or that we partner you with if you are there by yourself. I do this with a co-presenter, catherine Petzold. She's fabulous, she's a singer-songwriter and she just has this amazing energy that you know.
Speaker 1:We kind of balance each other out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, um, and what do we cover? We cover, um, you know, the. The main thing we cover in the first day is your relationship to yourself and understanding the main skill, which is how to regulate yourself when you are triggered.
Speaker 2:That's huge yeah it's yeah, it's huge, because it is the foundation, foundational skill that is necessary to employ in order to use any other skill that you are ever taught. Okay, mm-hmm? So the first day is about your relationship to yourself. We talk about self-esteem, we talk about boundaries and we talk about how those two things intersect, which is something that Terry real created. Mm-hmm, I'll give you all the details when I see you.
Speaker 1:So that's the first day. I'll give you all the details when I see you. All the golden nuggets.
Speaker 2:So that's the first day, and the second day is more about your relationship to each other, to others, and the skills necessary to bring you into loving, connection and repair. So all relationships, every single one, are an endless dance of harmony, disharmony, repair, back to harmony. But here's the thing most of us don't know how to do repair Right. That's why I say we people often end up in this sort of simmering, dishonest harmony. They've swept things under the rug or they've had this big blow up and there's no actual repair made around it. And so the second day of our workshop is the skills to help you actually learn how to come into repair. That's the 10,000 foot view of the two days.
Speaker 1:Right, exactly. Well, you summarized it well. I think you did a really good job. I mean it's funny because, again, I well, if there's anybody here, that's you know, read any Terry real books, then hats off to you. You probably have some idea of the direction that you know she's going in here. I mean, I remember, like, I know, like he's got this grid that, like, has helped me a lot. You know, foundationally thinking about, again, boundaries where I fall, where my partner fall, where other people that I'm, you know, coming into contact fall. That's helped me a lot.
Speaker 1:So, talk to us a little bit more about the setup, because I think for many people that you know, whether you've experienced couples or not, you know this kind of arena can maybe feel overwhelming or nerve wracking for some to think like, okay, like you know what at first again, this is what I thought too in when I was studying in grad school. Like, you know, in a group setting, are we all in a circle? Do we all have to now divulge all of our secrets publicly which makes me less inclined to want to go, especially if we have, say, a partner that already is possibly resistant? Like how do we help? Um, you know what I'm gonna say too, like, how do we help paint that picture? And what do you say to um, the individuals that say I really want to to go, I have a resistant partner, friend, family member, whatever. Yeah, I'm curious about that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, you bring up really important things. There's the before and after. Before, a lot of people say, oh, I don't know if I want to do this in a group, I don't want to know if I want to discuss this in front of others. And then they attend and afterwards they say, oh my God, I'm so glad I did this with other people. It was so helpful to know that I'm not alone, to hear what other people's questions were, to hear other people's stories. So that's a piece of it. Where do we ever talk about this stuff except behind the closed door of a therapist's office, which is an appropriate and necessary situation to have that confidentiality? And there's also we're born to be in connection, we're born to be in relationships, and so discussing some of these things is hugely helpful in feeling less alone.
Speaker 2:Now, more importantly even than that, the workshop is not therapy, it's not group therapy. It's neither of those things. It is educational and we have certain guidelines. So let me share what some of those guidelines are. First of all is the confidentiality rule. Anything that is discussed in that room stays in that room and we get everybody to agree to it. No identifying information is taken out of that room. Yep, right. So that's one piece. We get everybody to agree to that. But the other is also what we call the pass rule, p-a-s-s.
Speaker 2:If anything is asked, let's say to the group or to you one-on-one with somebody else. Or if I, as the leader, say hey Claire, you know what are your thoughts on this, which I don't usually do, we sort of put it out to the group. I don't target anybody. Let's say it that way is. We always have the pass rule. Anyone at any time can say you know, I'd rather pass, and the rest of us say thank you. You don't have to give a reason why you're passing, you don't have to justify it, just no, I'd rather pass. This is what we refer to as appropriately using your containing boundary, your containing psychological boundary, which is, I am going to contain myself, not open myself to sharing that kind of information, because I I just feel in this moment I I want to protect that and we respect that. So no one is pressured to say anything. You could literally come to the workshop and choose to say nothing.
Speaker 1:No problem. I mean, I'm sure there's, I'm sure sharing is encouraged, but I'm sure it's also on the other side of the coin. It's not like anyone's pressured whatsoever. You're not putting a hot seat or anything like that.
Speaker 2:And there's something else as well. We always set it up with the guideline of this uh, we always set it up with the the guideline of this share what you want to about yourself, but if you're there with your partner, you don't share about your partner.
Speaker 1:you let them share what they want to share about themselves obviously, as someone who's led these before, that makes a lot of sense and that, I think, also not only helps your participants, but even you know those that would be joining right. I think that's important to know so that they can know to not attack, but also to know that they won't be attacked. This is not a place to you know you're probably it's not a place to be shamed. Maybe it's an exploration of some of you know.
Speaker 2:shame might come to the surface, but Right, what we say is we encourage you to be brave, we try to create a brave space. We will make it as we will make it. You know, no relationship and no situation can be perfectly safe. Okay, what we do is our best to make it relatively safe. What we do is our best to make it relatively safe, and the rest is up to you as to how brave you want to be in either sharing or how protected you feel you need to be, and each person gets to determine that for themselves.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think that's important to know that, coming into this, that this is, and just like you said, leading with the educational piece of this workshop.
Speaker 1:Right, because it's a skill building workshop, you know, and there's not like a spotlight put on one person or one couple, and there's no requirements to share, to divulge, you know, um requirements to to share, to divulge, you know, and I think it's just if you realize that you're coming at this with the goal of healing relations, whether it's like with yourself or someone else, you know, and reminding ourselves that, like you said, we are built for connection and this workshop is geared toward helping us to have those skills to be better at relating to one another. You know, and I think, if you know, that's where it's rooted at and, just like you said, day one is foundationally about looking internally. To me, it kind of lays the groundwork sort of perfectly for everything else to come and and it's still even even at that point, just like you said, it's not, you know, you still don't have to share anything that you don't feel comfortable with, because the goal is to walk away with the tools and the education.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and then the thing that we are implementing after the September workshop is something new, which will be an ongoing monthly community led by me and Catherine. You can join or not join, like it's optional, but we want people to have the support to continue the practice of these skills. We look at this as a relational practice, relational mindfulness, very much like a yoga practice or an exercise practice. It's not something you oh, you're going to get these tools and then you've got them and you're done. No, no, this takes practice ongoing and we need support to do that. And so Catherine and I are kicking off our Relationship Intelligence Community after the September workshop and we need support to do that. And so Catherine and I are kicking off our relationship intelligence community after the September workshop, and we only do this workshop twice a year.
Speaker 2:So if you're, listening and want to do this jump on it now, because we won't be doing it again until sometime in the spring. We haven't set a date for the for the first one in 2026. Yet Um and uh, early bird pricing ends August 31st, so we have um and I yeah, I remember your spring one goes pretty quickly.
Speaker 1:You know it was only a certain number of spots and um so and they and they will go fast. And you know, like I said, you only offer this twice a year and, yes, it's a whole weekend, but I kind of think it is sort of a beautiful way to you know treat yourself to a full connected weekend. You know whether you do, you know you choose to stay over and you know make a nice little. You know time for yourself.
Speaker 2:Get away, go have a crab cake. Go out on the water.
Speaker 1:You buy water, I know well not that we need to say this, but I think I mean I even double that because you know I'm obviously not in downtown annapolis but there's no like academy game, so there's no extra like right traffic that weekend, which is important, or it's not like boat week.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean, right we chose this weekend because of that, actually, because it's not a crazy weekend in Annapolis.
Speaker 1:Right, or or um, yeah, all of those things. So it's kind of like a nice, kind of perfect way to uh, an excuse to get down there. Um so, um, no, I fully agree. And, um, I mean, I, like I said, I mean I'm super excited because I've gotten a little bit of taste of Terry Rill's work, and outside of the books, and you know, I'm excited to learn a little bit more about what these skills are and how I can kind of keep using them and the analogy that I think of too, you know, just like therapy, right? I mean, I myself I have a bachelor's degree in psychology, master's degree in counseling psychology. You can sit here and say that I have some education in this field too, and yet I've been therapy for four years, and while I've worked on a lot of important stuff, you know, I've also reached milestones in therapy, where at one point I needed to be in therapy every week and then slowly drop down to every two weeks and then down to every month, oh, and guess what, now I'm back to every two and now I'm down to every three, because that's life.
Speaker 1:And the point that I'm trying to make here is like this is not yes, I'm, I'm using an example of individual therapy. But the point that I'm trying to make, it's not just work that you do once and then, or you learn it once and done, because it's how you practice it, it's how you live it, it's just like going. It's just like going to the gym and exercising and training your body. You know, yeah, you can learn all like learn all the moves. The moves aren't hard to do. Once you learn them, you got them right, but it's. Are you increasing your weight load? Are you managing your nutrition? All those things? It's you know.
Speaker 1:so, trying to use that same analogy, you know, internally and within our relationships, right, it's what we do, it's you know? Yeah, you maybe, maybe you can think of a time where you've had like that tough, that tough fight, that tough argument, and maybe you had a really good conversation and you were able to heal it after, right, and then maybe things were good for a little bit, and then the same situation occurs right, it's this, that's what you mean of just like that, in the way that cycle that you mentioned, of the harmony.
Speaker 2:That's the endless dance of harmony, disharmony repair and back to harmony Right, and it's in every relationship, it's in parent-child relationships. So you know, you were saying before it's two days, and I encourage people to think of it as an investment for their children as well. Oh, my gosh, you know one of the things that there's a quote from Terry Real, so let me say it here. It's part of the reason why we do this work, which is that family dysfunction rolls downhill like a fire in the woods. Rolls downhill like a fire in the woods, taking down everyone in its path, until one person in one generation has the courage to stand and face the flames. That person brings peace to their ancestors and spares the generations that follow. We call that person a hero. All of us have ways of interacting that the quote refers to as family dysfunction function. Some of it could be as severe as abuse okay, but some of it could be a milder version that we've all experienced. Look, I got teased when I was a kid. I was teased by my family for wanting attention.
Speaker 2:Okay, it's a small thing that has a big impact right, All of us have at least small things that have a big impact and we don't want to pass that on to our children. So part of why I'm so passionate about doing these workshops and doing the couples therapy that I do is to help people turn and face the flames from their own past experiences and stop them in their current relationships so they don't get passed on to their children yes, and thank you for bringing.
Speaker 1:We've talked about this point before and obviously even same with my own therapist, but I think that's just the perfect point that we want to make to um, two moms and other other women that may be be watching, because, um, that's the reality. We have so many of these little kids at home and I know um, as often, you know, we think about trying to be good parents to our children, and the right thing. We're very concerned about that. But it also does start at your foundation, um, of your family, and that's between you and your partner. You know, and and I think that's such, you know, you're right, it is an investment in your family. It's not just investment of your time and your marriage, but it's if you can heal that that portion you it can. It's just like a tree, right. It kind of just keeps expanding out.
Speaker 2:It's just like a tree right. It kind of just keeps expanding out. It has huge ripple effects, mm-hmm, you know? Terry talks of how he was raised by an abusive father and his greatest achievement in his life is that he has two grown sons who will not be saying the same thing.
Speaker 1:They weren't raised by an abusive, depressed man because terry changed the trajectory of that, instead of passing on right, right and, and that's such, that's such a beautiful thing. And then, and I think too, like knowing I guess that's the point, right, knowing, whatever past we've had, whatever, and I'm sure you would agree with this too you know there might be what we like to call big traumas, but even small traumas are still traumatic, right. That's why I know we hear like oh well, my pain isn't as bad as yours, it's still painful. That pain is still real and the pain is still valid, whatever your past looked like, whether it was with your parents, another partner, whatever the point is and have to do all the me work you're becoming something like this um, you know and uh, and I'm putting the quote exactly, but it's essentially like and that's what I think is really cool
Speaker 1:about quality relationship, um, relational life therapy is you're kind of like looking to heal each other through each other. Um, because of how you're kind of you're, you might whether, again, whether you're examining part of your past. But you know, if you're examining part of your past, you might be able to see where some of your own patterns come through and how they're being portrayed now, and I think that's really kind of a unique part of it.
Speaker 2:I can't wait to have you there. Maybe we could even chat on here afterwards, if if you want to, about your experience or whatever I'd totally be up for that.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, yes, we absolutely. And there's more content to come, clearly, because there's. I have so many nuggets about all of this. So this is not going to be the only piece that you're going to see of me and risa talking about this ahead of the workshop. But to wrap here, september 21st and 22nd correct no 20th and 21st oh, 20, 20th and 24.
Speaker 1:see, this is why we have the expert here, because my brain can only hold so much information. 21st, oh, 20,. 20 to 24. See, this is why we have the expert here, cause my brain can only hold so much information. 21st, in downtown Annapolis, and you said the early bird tickets are until August 31st.
Speaker 2:That's right. That's right. The website to get the tickets on is my website together couplescounselingcom. Just go to the relationship skills boot camp on the top of the web page and it'll take you right there perfect um, and I will be sharing that um.
Speaker 1:You'll be able to get to it, um on our events page. Um, obviously, the podcast here, um and um in our links. So, um, this will certainly be shared for all of you to kind of check out. Obviously, yeah, jump on the early bird pricing while you can, because I think that's a great option for you. But if you have any other questions, feel free to message me or, obviously, risa, directly. Yeah, feel free to your FAQ. Does a really good job of answering some of those other commonly asked questions too. But if you have any personal concerns about you're about this workshop for yourself, certainly be sure to reach out to Risa. I know she'll help you navigate.
Speaker 2:I'm happy to answer any questions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, thank you so much for your time today, risa. We are so excited for this workshop and we're looking forward to doing it.
Speaker 2:Thanks, Claire. It's always a pleasure to chat with you and I'll see you in person in September.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Thank you so much. Thanks for tuning into this episode of Mom Talk, Maryland. If you loved it, leave a review, share it with a friend or tag me at thecolumbiamom on Instagram. I'd love to hear what you think and don't forget to follow the show so you never miss an episode. Until next time, keep showing up, keep supporting local and keep being the incredible mom, woman, human that you are.